GBRCAA Forum

F3P Indoor Aerobatics => Construction, Finishing and Equipment => Topic started by: angelwing on 09, November 2012, 12:57:19 pm

Title: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: angelwing on 09, November 2012, 12:57:19 pm

My Own design "Yofiel" Biplane


Wingspan  720mm
Fuselage length 935mm
RTF Weight inc Battery 106g
4 x HS 5035HB's
Hyperion or Turnigy 2s 180mah
YGE 4 esc with double diodes as a voltage dropper

Top wing has Anhedral, Bottom wing Dihedral and the Tailplane also has Anhedral.
If the wind dies down enough the indoor test flight is tonight, I havent made a transport box yet!
[size=78%] [/size](http://sphotos-e.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/532343_3350064970070_1377181024_n.jpg)



Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: Matt Hoyland on 09, November 2012, 07:03:50 pm
Looks good Andy.  Hope to see it fly on Sunday!
Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: angelwing on 10, November 2012, 05:02:17 pm
4g heavier no as Ive added a M5 steel nut to the nose to tweak the CG

Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: angelwing on 18, November 2012, 04:49:37 pm
Be good to see some pictures of the Disney's / other models and specs guys

Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: barnesyboy on 19, November 2012, 07:51:56 pm
My loaner (because I know you were dying to know the specs) was a about 70 quid all up

Hobby King Galaxy
Motor: Whatever came in the kit
ESC: unbranded 10amp
Servos: blue ones
RX: Orange one
Lipo: 2 cells
Weight: Think Wot 4


Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: Matt Hoyland on 19, November 2012, 08:26:00 pm
Disney
 
Glavak Motor with 9x2.5 Carbon Prop
Flighttech 6A ESC
LSX065 servos on elevator and rudder
1x Hitec HS-5035HD on ailerons.
Futaba R6004FF Rx
180mAh 2S LiPo
RTF Weight = 105g
Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: Gary Holland on 19, November 2012, 09:31:36 pm
Disney

Turnigy 6amp ESC
Turnigy 2204-14 motor (lightened)
SD100's elevator/rudder
SD 150 ailerons
Orange 4 channel Rx
Hyperion 180 packs
SG carbon prop (no idea what size though, it was a freebie from AW  ;) )
RTF weight 105grms
Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: Ashley Hoyland on 19, November 2012, 10:20:52 pm
Disney

Hacker A15 10S
Flighttech 6amp ESC.
3 x JR ES 316
Spectrum micro receiver
Hyperion 240mAh
Prop GWS 8 x 4.3
RTF weight  118 grams
Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: David Kirk on 20, November 2012, 06:49:08 pm
Helix

Axi 2203/52
Jeti 08 Advance ESC (lightened a little)
Glavak 9 x 3.5 but now more like 8.7 x 3.5
Hyperion 2s 180's (lightened a little)
LSX110 on rudder
LSX065 on elevator and aileron
All servos running directly on 8.4v
Jeti R6G (3.5g) receiver running on 8.4v with telemetry

Made from normal Depron but only lightly milled. AUW 132g :-(

Would give the Disney's a run for the money if the weight came down to 105g I reckon (Germans build sub 100g versions). Just needs Depron Aero and some MTF milling.

So ugly that the forum software refused to upload a picture (I haven't got one really).

Dav
Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: Gary Holland on 21, November 2012, 02:45:06 pm
Don't worry Dave, I have  ;)
Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: barnesyboy on 21, November 2012, 07:43:19 pm
that pic dosnt make it look ant were near ugly enough

BB
Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: angelwing on 25, November 2012, 07:58:37 pm
Yofiel is now flying very nice, so theres no excuse for me not to enter the next comp other than my thumbs, but thats my problem....


Yofiel V2 is already drawn with even more milling where it matters and less where it doesn't. slightly revised wing shape and ailerons and a longer nose to allow me to keep the weight the same as I'm currently flying at, not saying any more than that  ::)





Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: BrianH2 on 06, December 2012, 01:00:34 pm
Thought I'd add my two-penneth worth !
Disney
2204-14 motor (not lightened!)
Turnigy 6A esc
D47s servos all round
Hyperion 120mAh (lightened)
RTF 109gms
 
Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: paul wilco on 06, December 2012, 06:54:24 pm
Love the scheme on the Disney, looks awesome Brian. Cant wait to see it fly pal.
Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: BrianH2 on 06, December 2012, 09:59:39 pm
Love the scheme on the Disney, looks awesome Brian. Cant wait to see it fly pal.
Thanks mate!  You really need to get yours done - I promise you that you'll love it !!   ;)
Haven't managed to get much time on it - and there's still a bit of 'tuning' required but its already feeling pretty good in the air!!
Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: Josh & Andy James on 07, December 2012, 10:12:03 am
The Disney, prop and the Carbons arrived, ordering servos next so much choice  :-\
Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: BrianH2 on 07, December 2012, 12:09:48 pm
The Disney, prop and the Carbons arrived, ordering servos next so much choice  :-\

Go for either to LSX110 or the Dymond D47S ....nice servos   ;)
 
Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: Josh & Andy James on 07, December 2012, 03:12:59 pm

Go for either to LSX110 or the Dymond D47S ....nice servos   ;)

I can only find SD 100s so far which are supposed to be the same as a D47, im not sure. but they seem slow compared to LSX110 and Hitec HS-5035HD, will it make much differance   
Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: BrianH2 on 07, December 2012, 04:22:42 pm
Just checked out 'electricwingman' and he's out of stock for most of the usual servos...might be worth you emailing to see when they're likely to get them back in again.
If you're going to the trouble (and expense) of putting a Disney together....might as well put good servos in it   :)
 
Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: Gary Holland on 07, December 2012, 05:41:04 pm
SD100, D47 and LSX 110's are all the same and Dymond and Logic both do a higher speed version, with less torque. However Connor and I are both using the normal (slooooow) model and there more than upto the task. If you really feel they do need pepping up, you can always run them straight off 7.4V.

Just bought 4 HS-35's for another project and 2 of them were duff - and that's not the first time I've had that. Great servo, but if I were you I'd stear clear until Hitec get their QC together  ;)

Gaz
Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: Chris Currie on 07, December 2012, 06:23:29 pm
I was warned off the micro hitec digis before due to lack of accuracy when centering. I went with the JR DS318's which are superb, though more expensive and a little heavier. To be honest for F3P schedules accuracy is more important than speed when it comes to servos, and of course lightness helps. For 3D and freestyling the quicker servos are more of a benefit in my opinion.
 
Some nice models on here, might even manage to get one put together for EIM!  :)
Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: Ashley Hoyland on 07, December 2012, 07:00:01 pm
Hi Andy

Never been sure about HiTec.

I use these http://www.macgregor.co.uk/jrpropo/ES316.htm 

£19.99 on the Macgregor web site but may be lower price elsewhere. 

£16.99 at http://www.stevewebb.co.uk/index.php?pid=JRES316&area=Servo

http://www.stevewebb.co.uk/index.php?pid=SWLSX110&area=Servo £15.99.  Appears they do not have stock, sorry.

Ashley
Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: Josh & Andy James on 07, December 2012, 11:06:39 pm
Cheers guys, really helpful I've ordered a LSX 110 for the ailerons and poss some 065 for the Rudder,elevators
Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: angelwing on 09, December 2012, 04:24:05 pm
Hitec 5035's  :(


Fast and thats about it. Centering int all bad but I have had two fail just after install with the same fault and a third after half a dozen flights. For F3P the Dymond's are really hard to beat in whatever disguise you find them

Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: paul wilco on 01, January 2013, 06:23:27 pm
Yet another "Disney"


Glavak motor with 9x2.8 carbon prop
LSX 180 aileron, direct voltage
LSX 65 on tail surfaces, direct voltage
YGE4 esc
Hyperion 180 batteries
Martin Muller control horn linkage set
"Beast" wheels
Multiplex M-Link rx6 light micro receiver


Massive thanks to the one and only Brian Holford, for graphic design and airbrush work.

Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: David Kirk on 01, January 2013, 10:22:30 pm
Exactly the same setup I bought to go in my Disney one day soon; assuming I ever kill the Helix  :P


What is your flying weight with that little lot?


Dave
Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: paul wilco on 02, January 2013, 10:28:18 am
Dave


No idea about the weight, as i don't have any scales. Its not the lightest Disney compared to others I have picked up. I have gone for a bit of extra reinforcement here and there. I have also used a push rod on elevator instead of pull pull. The servos are very sweet and the Glavak and YGE combination is just awesome. Just wish I had the skills to do it justice in the air. Looking forward to seeing you on Sunday.
Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: BrianH2 on 02, January 2013, 05:11:40 pm
mmm...why do I have the feeling that you're going to dominate 'B' more than usual !!!   ;)
Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: barnesyboy on 02, January 2013, 08:37:44 pm
Because he is :(

BB
Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: angelwing on 02, January 2013, 08:50:42 pm
Its all about the torque roll guys, and were all f******* c**p at it  >:(
Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: BrianH2 on 02, January 2013, 09:41:35 pm
Its all about the torque roll guys, and were all f******* c**p at it  >:(
LOL !!!!!    ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: angelwing on 02, January 2013, 10:09:53 pm
Besides how the hell do you do a torque roll when you've gone to great lengths to eliminate the torque  ::)

Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: BrianH2 on 02, January 2013, 10:14:35 pm
Besides how the hell do you do a torque roll when you've gone to great lengths to eliminate the torque  ::)

same as the rest of us...hammer the ailerons over and pray !!!    ;)
Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: paul wilco on 02, January 2013, 10:25:40 pm
Andy, is so right its all about the torque roll and we are all crap at it, but Ray W and Mark T wont be. (BB is quite good at it too)
Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: paul wilco on 02, January 2013, 10:30:15 pm
Infact, thinking about it this is how i see the 'B' torque roll leader board at the moment


1st  Mark Barnes
2nd Brian Holford
3rd  Andy Whitehead
4th Paul Wilcockson


Be interesting to add up scores from last comp to confirm.
Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: Rob Piechulski on 02, January 2013, 10:50:06 pm
If there only was THE Trouting take off ..... I'd be rocking - with the score for that I'd not have to fly anything else to win ....  !!!

Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: paul wilco on 02, January 2013, 10:55:29 pm
Yeah Rob, do you mind sharing the control inputs for that please,  might use it in my EIM freestyle.
Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: Rob Piechulski on 02, January 2013, 11:01:39 pm
You need strong musculus sphincter ani externus.
You need project X model
You need about 15deg left on the Rudder while take off - so it won't hit Steve right away.
The rest will happened itself  ::)
Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: Gary Holland on 03, January 2013, 08:36:15 am
Steve's Promo Disney

D47's (might as well used 3001's)
Turnigy 2202-14 (on 6s)
Turnigy 6amp esc
4 gallons of Dulux vinyl matt
A bigger airbrush next time

Weight: Think Bismarck
Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: Josh & Andy James on 03, January 2013, 08:40:28 am
 
And yet another Disney

Josh had a big grin last night so guess he likes it. ;D
Hacker 10-15S with a 7*4 prop just to test
(Glavak ordered  ;) )
Robotbirds 6a esc
LSX 110 on Ailerons
LSX 065 on Rudder/Elevator
Wheels from a Bluefox
Orange RX
Weight - I’m a bit disappointed with it, 97g without a battery – too much glue I guess  :( 
 
Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: Matt Hoyland on 03, January 2013, 09:50:27 am
Infact, thinking about it this is how i see the 'B' torque roll leader board at the moment


1st  Mark Barnes
2nd Brian Holford
3rd  Andy Whitehead
4th Paul Wilcockson


Be interesting to add up scores from last comp to confirm.

The scores do confirm you're all rubbish at the torque roll (but then so am I :D )

Overall averages from the first 2 comps:-
Andy - 5.5
Brian - 5.4
Paul - 5.1
BB - 4.9

BB let himself and his peeps down with a few 0's which dragged his average down, Andy was at a distinct advantage as he had 6 less opportunities to drag his average down as he didn't do the first comp.  Just from the last comp it looks like this:-

Brian - 6.1
Andy - 5.5
Paul - 5.4
BB - 4.6
Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: paul wilco on 03, January 2013, 09:51:53 am
Looks awesome Andy, you have done him proud. Great weight too. Should fly sweet.
Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: barnesyboy on 03, January 2013, 10:48:10 am
Dont know whats more depressing, all them Disneys or my TR average, freestyle god my ass :(

BB
Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: paul wilco on 03, January 2013, 10:49:11 am
The scores do confirm you're all rubbish at the torque roll (but then so am I :D )

Overall averages from the first 2 comps:-
Andy - 5.5
Brian - 5.4
Paul - 5.1
BB - 4.9

BB let himself and his peeps down with a few 0's which dragged his average down, Andy was at a distinct advantage as he had 6 less opportunities to drag his average down as he didn't do the first comp.  Just from the last comp it looks like this:-

Brian - 6.1
Andy - 5.5
Paul - 5.4
BB - 4.6


Thanks for those stats Matt. There is certainly room for improvement for us 'B' boys.
Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: Matt Hoyland on 03, January 2013, 11:17:09 am
Room for improvement for some in the TR in the A as well :) ::) :'(
 
Connor - 8.5
Gaz - 7.5
Matt - 6.6
Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: BrianH2 on 03, January 2013, 01:47:57 pm
Dont know whats more depressing, all them Disneys or my TR average, freestyle god my ass :(

BB

dood, freestyling ain't just about the torque roll....it's about the attitude - and you got plenty of that !!   ;)
 
Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: Steve Schafer on 03, January 2013, 07:59:48 pm
Cheers Gaz for painting it mate but next time could you use a airbrush not a roller ;) 4 gallons of paint is a bit excessive :D
Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: Gary Holland on 03, January 2013, 08:35:49 pm
Cheers Gaz for painting it mate but next time could you use a airbrush not a roller ;) 4 gallons of paint is a bit excessive :D

I'll just show it the colour swatches next time then  ;)
Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: angelwing on 03, January 2013, 10:11:18 pm
The scores do confirm you're all rubbish at the torque roll (but then so am I :D )

Overall averages from the first 2 comps:-
Andy - 5.5
Brian - 5.4
Paul - 5.1
BB - 4.9

BB let himself and his peeps down with a few 0's which dragged his average down, Andy was at a distinct advantage as he had 6 less opportunities to drag his average down as he didn't do the first comp.  Just from the last comp it looks like this:-

Brian - 6.1
Andy - 5.5
Paul - 5.4
BB - 4.6


Just like to point out its all Skill Matt as I' have the major disadvantage of going to great expenses (blagging skills) to remove the torque from my model

Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: angelwing on 03, January 2013, 10:14:24 pm
Steve's Promo Disney

D47's (might as well used 3001's)
Turnigy 2202-14 (on 6s)
Turnigy 6amp esc
4 gallons of Dulux vinyl matt
A bigger airbrush next time

Weight: Think Bismarck


My Guess is 117g RTF
Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: angelwing on 03, January 2013, 10:16:59 pm
I'm aiming for a 6.9 average torque roll this coming comp  ;D

Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: Steve Schafer on 03, January 2013, 11:01:18 pm
My Comp Disney
Glavak motor with SG prop
6amp ESC
3 D47s servos
Spectrum rx
120mah battery
Weight is 96 grams 
Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: BrianH2 on 03, January 2013, 11:28:21 pm

120mah battery

Steve, be warned...flying back to back rounds for 1&2 and 3&4 you might find that you run out of juice on a 120mAh battery for the second flight....unless you're chaning the lipo after each flight ???
Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: Gary Holland on 04, January 2013, 07:12:59 am

My Guess is 117g RTF

160g Andy  ;D
Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: Steve Schafer on 04, January 2013, 11:18:24 am
That was my plan Brian to change battery if i was aloud to if not ill just use a 180.
Flew the HEAVY Disney last night and its defo a freestyle Disney lol. Still flys very well even with all the extra weight.
Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: BrianH2 on 04, January 2013, 01:54:53 pm
That was my plan Brian to change battery if i was aloud to if not ill just use a 180.
Flew the HEAVY Disney last night and its defo a freestyle Disney lol. Still flys very well even with all the extra weight.

I think you be allowed mate but honestly theres little or no weight difference between the 120 and the 180...I think with my Hyperion packs it was about 1gm 
Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: angelwing on 04, January 2013, 08:43:21 pm
No problems changing the pack between flights Steve.
you would easily fly 2 rounds of f3P-B on the 120's but might be on the limits of the 120 for 2 x F3P-A flights
Nothing worse than running out of power 3/4way through the torque rolls, doesnt do the rudder much good ;)

Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: angelwing on 04, January 2013, 08:49:42 pm
Room for improvement for some in the TR in the A as well :) ::) :'(
 
Connor - 8.5
Gaz - 7.5
Matt - 6.6


Your right Matt there certainly is Connors are really quite scruffy compared to last year  :P



Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: Steve Schafer on 05, January 2013, 12:35:18 am
Ok thats good to know cheers guys :)
Defo dont want to run out of power half way through the second flight never know i may not make it that far ;)
Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: Josh & Andy James on 09, January 2013, 10:52:40 am

And yet another Disney

Josh had a big grin last night so guess he likes it. ;D
Hacker 10-15S with a 7*4 prop just to test
(Glavak ordered  ;) )
Robotbirds 6a esc
LSX 110 on Ailerons
LSX 065 on Rudder/Elevator
Wheels from a Bluefox
Orange RX
Weight - I’m a bit disappointed with it, 97g without a battery – too much glue I guess  :( 
 

The Glavak has arrived  :)  so more work  :(  Josh will be chuffed though
Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: angelwing on 09, January 2013, 09:19:27 pm
Take your time and strip down the esc to remove all the excess wires. You will be surprised how easily a couple of grams disappear this way. The long thin wires on the Glavak can be soldered directly to the PCB of the esc



Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: paul wilco on 09, January 2013, 09:33:51 pm
 Just sit admire it for a couple of days first Andy, they are just gorgeous little motors !!
Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: Josh & Andy James on 10, January 2013, 01:16:48 pm
Cheers guys  :)  been drooling abit over the Deltang receivers and a YGE Im getting obssessed with my weight  :-X
Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: angelwing on 10, January 2013, 07:10:40 pm
Hi Andy, I asked about the Deltang 7 channel RX as I had plans to put 4 aileron servos on the bipe and use them for airbrakes.
I could not be assured though that the range would be sufficient for the EIM, a real pity as air-brakes on the bipe would have been very interesting.
You only save about 0.7g by using the YGE esc when you've added all the leads over a standard 6 amp esc. I have YGE esc's and must admit they are very good, but expensive compared to what they offer over anything else, which is really just the 0.7g saving and for that you sacrifice the BEC circuitry

Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: Josh & Andy James on 11, January 2013, 10:57:08 am
Hi Andy, I asked about the Deltang 7 channel RX as I had plans to put 4 aileron servos on the bipe and use them for airbrakes.
I could not be assured though that the range would be sufficient for the EIM, a real pity as air-brakes on the bipe would have been very interesting.
You only save about 0.7g by using the YGE esc when you've added all the leads over a standard 6 amp esc. I have YGE esc's and must admit they are very good, but expensive compared to what they offer over anything else, which is really just the 0.7g saving and for that you sacrifice the BEC circuitry

Hi Andy That is a shame the one I was looking at should have 'Parkfly type range' but was a 6 channel, I guess its the should have bit I need to consider  :)
 
http://robotbirds.com/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=85_122_528&products_id=6350 (http://robotbirds.com/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=85_122_528&products_id=6350)
 
http://www.lipoly.de/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=264_272_2860_2861_3214&products_id=209197 (http://www.lipoly.de/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=264_272_2860_2861_3214&products_id=209197)
 
The Orange Rx I use is only 2.5g with heatshrink so I guess its ok consisdering the loss of signal with the Deltang
 
I wired up the Glavak last night with a stripped down FlightTech, with mount and prop its 5.5g lighter than the previous set up, which is good and some 180 Lipos on the way should make a big differance
 
 
 
 
Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: angelwing on 11, January 2013, 08:49:24 pm
If you unsolder the pins from you orange receiver you will loose just over a gram, and there is absolutely no need for the heat-shrink either  :D
All of my Receivers sit naked on the models ;)


Dont worry about it though Andy Josh was flying the Disney really well. Also have to remember by putting the Glavak Contra onto the bipe I gained 10g over the original model weight and it flies better and more settled in the air with the extra few grams




Andy

Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: BrianH2 on 31, January 2013, 05:32:24 pm
New offering for the last League comp and for EIM.....
 
Mark 2 version Disney (with deeper fuselage)
 
Specs:
Glavak Motor with SG09x3.8 prop
YGE04 ESC
Dymond DS47S on Ailerons
LSX65 on elevator and rudder
Spektrum Rx 6115E
120mAh or 180mAh lipo...depending which works out better
and absolutely no 'ADL' technology built in
 
Flying weight with the 120mAh....  104gms
 
Happy Holford   8)
Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: paul wilco on 31, January 2013, 07:02:33 pm
yummy yummy. Love it !!!
Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: barnesyboy on 02, February 2013, 08:10:06 pm
Nice work brother
Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: Josh & Andy James on 07, February 2013, 04:06:28 pm
Just found these whilst surfing seems a tad heavy tho
 
http://www.modellhobby.de/Models/Modelplanes/Indoor-Parkflyer/HCF-BLUE-FOX-with-motor-ESC-servos-prop.htm?shop=k_staufenb_e&SessionId=&a=article&ProdNr=0870020C&t=3&c=62&p=62 (http://www.modellhobby.de/Models/Modelplanes/Indoor-Parkflyer/HCF-BLUE-FOX-with-motor-ESC-servos-prop.htm?shop=k_staufenb_e&SessionId=&a=article&ProdNr=0870020C&t=3&c=62&p=62)
 
http://www.modellhobby.de/Models/Modelplanes/Indoor-Parkflyer/HCF-SU-29.htm?shop=k_staufenb_e&SessionId=&a=article&ProdNr=0870016&t=3&c=62&p=62 (http://www.modellhobby.de/Models/Modelplanes/Indoor-Parkflyer/HCF-SU-29.htm?shop=k_staufenb_e&SessionId=&a=article&ProdNr=0870016&t=3&c=62&p=62)

 
Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: Mikey Blake on 05, March 2013, 08:50:06 pm
Hi, im new to F3P. just wondering how much Expo and Surface throw i will need starting off and fine tune from there. Im hoping to compete next year but not sure of how to set-up one of these models for competition flight. In going to use the adjustable motor mount to get my thrust angles right, suggested by Mark Barnes. Is there any other major things i need to know. Im currently building an Armonia.


Thanks
Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: angelwing on 06, March 2013, 06:15:02 pm
Hi Mikey,


Throw away the GWS 8x4.3 prop and get yourself a fine pitched 9" prop such as a Glavak 9x2 or a PT 9 x 2.3


Dont be surprised if you end up with more than 45 degrees of throw and loads of Expo. 60% expo is common on most F3P setups with max'd out throws. Theres no time in F3P schedules to be switching flight modes so I don't bother with them at all.


Another thing worth doing is to set up a throttle curve so you always have "tickover" this helps braking in the downline sand spool up particularly with the coggy little Hackers.


Oh and ear defenders for the horrible whine for the A10's  ;D  you'll understand what I mean when you hear the original Tube mount Glavak motors when you join us for a few comps  8)


For the record the Hacker whines like a mother in law on HRT  ::)



Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: Mikey Blake on 07, March 2013, 01:24:59 am
Haha thats so funny cant wait to hear it now!! ;D


Ok il have a look at some of the PT props. In using PT on F3A plane and IMAC.


Ok thanks for that, that's a good starting point and i like high Expo to.


Question. My Hacker X5 esc has a setting brake on it. should i use the brake on a downline with 0%  Throttle or still have a small bit of throttle or should i turn off the break altogether and just let the prop do all the breaking.


Thanks for your help. :)







Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: Rob Piechulski on 07, March 2013, 01:50:05 pm
Slow spinning prop will give more breaking than when stopped.
Besides - with the small Hacker the spinning might help - they are not only loud - they have strange delay/hesitation after cutting the power and then adding - I never could get use to it - at first I thought It was just me - but changed the motor and the difference was huge straight away !   

Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: angelwing on 07, March 2013, 04:06:09 pm
The Hacker feels like it has hexagonal bearing so you won't need the esc brake ;)


I'm not anti Hacker BTW, there are just better motors for F3P for the same money


The A10-12s is an awesome little motor for pylon and 100g fun models






Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: Mikey Blake on 07, March 2013, 09:24:49 pm
Cool thanks for the heads up, have the model nearly finished. Using the new Eflite 7100 digital servo's in it, same as what is in the new QQ edge 540. 3.5 gram servo. Should be powerful enough. :)
Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: angelwing on 08, March 2013, 05:06:45 pm
Be interesting to hear more about the servos

Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: Mikey Blake on 09, March 2013, 12:20:38 pm
I will keep you posted, Im a little concerned about using them for the ailerons in terms of power but they are very precise and should be well you to the job. Im using all nano light servos and rx to keep the weight down. :)
Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: Mikey Blake on 09, March 2013, 12:26:11 pm
Another question. Im using a Hacker X-5 Pro Brushless ESC and i cant find anywhere were is says the output voltage. I know some guys are using HV servos with this esc and i just want to make sure of the output voltage before i plug in the servos encase its straight 2s. it said in the instruction that is has a 2amp linear bec but can i take that as 6.0v or 5.5v :(
Thanks
Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: Rob Piechulski on 09, March 2013, 03:33:28 pm
All BECs are supposed to regulate the output, so they always deliver 5V
It doesn't realy matter what servo and esc you use - Using HV servos you connect them directly to the LiPo anyway and BEC has nothing to do with them (hence the choice of ESC's for F3P without any BEC - to save weight - saying more - I can't see the point to use HV servos if you connect them to the BEC ;)

Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: Mikey Blake on 09, March 2013, 05:58:14 pm
Cool thanks for clearing that up Rob. Ya in the instructions for the Armonia its all jr HV servos. Dont know many their just good servos regulated aswell. Anyway im hoping to get started flying F3P in the next to weeks. F3A and college is starting to take up all my time but cant complain. :)
Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: Rob Piechulski on 09, March 2013, 07:37:20 pm
As good as they are the JR servos - I think there is a lot of marketing blah blah and the designer of the model must be sponsored by the JR.
spec for JR DS319 HV (Digital)
6.0V 0.6kg / cm 0.10sec / 60°        7.4V 0.7kg / cm 0.08sec / 60°
against spec for the JR 318 (digital)
Torque: 0.7Kg
Speed: 0.08 S
/60 degrees

JR 316 (analog)
Torque: 0.7Kg
Speed: 0.08 S
/60 degrees

The conclusion is - don't use the HV connected to the BEC as they will be slower than the cheaper low voltage servos !
with the ESC 6A - stripped from everything - you can get down to 3.5-4g  ish - that's including BEC  !

the JR's HV are much more expensive than the Dymonds - are heavier - and the dymonds work on 7.4V anyway without any fancy sticker ;)

PS. I think I saw 2mm connectors on your motor - get rid of that - solder the motor directly to the ESC - that's easy and significant saving ;)



Will be great to see you flying with us - I started flying F3P this year and the support from everybody is fantastic - great experience :)


Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: David Kirk on 09, March 2013, 08:04:32 pm
HV's designed to run straight off the 2S lipo. Good if you have a full set of HV servos. You simply bypass the BEC. I do it by desoldering the positive servo wire from the ESC and resoldering it to the positive battery input. BEC is not used then and RX is getting 8.4v


I use Jeti radio gear that can run off 8.4v with Dymond D47 servos (also 8.4v). The main reason being I can use the RX battery voltage telemetry to tell me the flight pack voltage. No more timers and no more knackered batteries.
Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: David Kirk on 09, March 2013, 08:09:00 pm
On the servo power front you tend to find people using more than they need.


I ended up using a single Dymond D47S on my Helix ailerons with no blowback in the last season of A. This is the fast version that offers half the torque of the normal one. A whopping 0.65kg/cm


Good hinging, good linkages will make more of a difference than power.
Title: Re: F3P Models and Specs
Post by: Mikey Blake on 11, March 2013, 01:51:25 am
Ok thanks Rob and David.


For the mean time im going to keep it with the BEC on the Eflite 7100 3.5g servos. I think i will have to extend the arms to get more throw on the elevator and rudder. Ailerons seem ok!!


The servos are 0.05 sec with a BEC so not bad. 


Yes Rob im planning on just soldering them straight on but will just get it flying for now.


There actually could be two of us going over. My friend Robert Telford on the Irish F3A 2013 team has bought an Armonia after seeing mine so the plan is for the two of use to hopefully get over to a competition or two.


Really looking forward to it now. :)