Author Topic: Scoring take off & Landing with a model without u/c  (Read 445 times)

Offline Eddie Clanzy-Hodge

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Scoring take off & Landing with a model without u/c
« on: 01, February 2019, 11:40:22 PM »
This may well seem to be a silly question BUT
I have converted a 1970's slope soarer to electric.  It is aerobatic enough to do the clubman schedule and possibly the intermediate schedule.
However it has to be hand launched and needs to land on grass because it does not have any u/c.
If I ever used this in a comp I assume that I would get zero points for both the take off and landings.  The take off would be "assisted" and the landing would have to be be off the tarmac runway, if one is being used.
Is that correct?




Offline Ashley Hoyland

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Re: Scoring take off & Landing with a model without u/c
« Reply #1 on: 02, February 2019, 10:10:34 AM »
Dear Eddie

You are correct in your assumption that an assisted takeoff is not acceptable, however the rules for landing only say that your model must land within a certain area.

The FAI Rules and therefore the GBRCAA rules state that your model should be capable of an unassisted take-off.

However, (and this bit of my reply may be controversial), if this was the only aircraft you have and you wanted to enter your first Clubman competition, with the mutual agreement of the Contest Director before you enter the competition, you may be allowed to fly.

If you want to gain experience it would be more likely to be able to fly at one of our Introduction to Aerobatics Days at Buckminster (and I know this would not be a problem as we accept any aircraft under 7Kgs which is within the noise limits) or one of our New Pilots Open Days, but again this would be with the prior agreement of the organiser.

I hope this helps.

Ashley
« Last Edit: 02, February 2019, 10:12:51 AM by Ashley Hoyland »

Offline Eddie Clanzy-Hodge

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Re: Scoring take off & Landing with a model without u/c
« Reply #2 on: 02, February 2019, 06:23:19 PM »
Thanks Ashley,


Your reply is sort of what I expected.  Thanks.


Trouble is that I used to fly Masters in the 1990's and then had a layoff until 3 years ago, so I cannot claim special dispensation for being a novice!


I do also have an electric Moonglow, so I would probably use that for any comps, unless I get out my original Hanno powered comp model from 1996.  I was thinking abut the 2019 nats just to be there, enter and soak up the atmosphere.


Thanks again
Eddie




Offline Mike Wood

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Re: Scoring take off & Landing with a model without u/c
« Reply #3 on: 02, February 2019, 06:34:56 PM »
Hi Eddie

Would be great to see you back. I remember those days at the Nats  8)

I'm only just getting back to the comps myself.

Definitely enter the Nats to fly and see you there.

Mike

Offline Ashley Hoyland

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Re: Scoring take off & Landing with a model without u/c
« Reply #4 on: 02, February 2019, 07:53:13 PM »
Eddie


You would still be welcome at our sessions at Buckminster.


Ashley

Offline Stuart Mellor

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Re: Scoring take off & Landing with a model without u/c
« Reply #5 on: 03, February 2019, 06:14:25 PM »

Re the hand launch scenario  - people with long memories will remember that gliders were allowed in F3A under FAI rules many years ago - using a tow line!
It would be a poor CD indeed who didn't allow a hand launched model - and against the rules. The competitor would simply lose take off points in the Clubman & Intermediate schedules. Most sites are grass (apart from Barkston) - so landings would not be a problem.


ps - "the unassisted take off rule" - can be misinterpreted. It's simply there to avoid a helper/ competitor interfering with the model on take off & gaining points. It's not there to preclude anyone from entering the competition who hand launches the model.
« Last Edit: 03, February 2019, 06:16:06 PM by Stuart Mellor »

Offline Eddie Clanzy-Hodge

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Re: Scoring take off & Landing with a model without u/c
« Reply #6 on: 04, February 2019, 10:13:33 PM »
Hi All,
Thanks to all for all your replies.
Seeing that I am now boring old fart, I have recently had trouble with my old Hanno powered model and the new electric Moonglow at our field, because it is not very good for landing fastish models with a long low glide path.  The converted slope soarer works really well because it is a lot slower.  This is the original model that I flew in slope aerobatics in the late 60's/early 70's.
However, there IS plenty of room at Barkston, so I think it would be better if I used the old Hanno model or the Moonglow.  I just need to practice with both and hope our field does not give me too many landing problems!
With luck I hope to see you all again at Barkston.
Eddie


Offline Mike Wood

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Re: Scoring take off & Landing with a model without u/c
« Reply #7 on: 04, February 2019, 10:33:08 PM »
Hi Eddie

I was just wondering if it might be worth trying both ailerons drooped to give some flap effect
for slower landing approaches, testing at height and simulated landing at height before committing
to the real thing.

What do others think?

Cheerio

Mike

p.s. You're not a BOF because you're hoping to fly at Barkston!  8)

Offline Eddie Clanzy-Hodge

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Re: Scoring take off & Landing with a model without u/c
« Reply #8 on: 05, February 2019, 12:10:16 AM »
Hi Mike,
I used to try that sort of trick years ago and it never seemed to make a lot of difference.  I ended up doing a lot of side slipping instead in those days.


I have recently experimented with the powered glider and have discovered that up aileron and down elevator mix does bring it down quicker but doesn't appear to affect the speed of the model.  I guess that down aileron and, probably, up elevator trim, would slow the model up but it also reduces the rate of descent - so it flies further!


ALSO - the Moonglow has outboard ailerons.  Down flaperon on that could make it a lot more prone to tip stalling.  Up flaperon would reduce tip stalling and allow me to stall the inner wing but keep the outer wing flying cleanly.


It is all a bit complex but when the weather gets better I will try the Moonglow with upward flaperon (?airbrakes) for landing.


Thanks for the suggestion.


Eddie


Offline Mike Wood

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Re: Scoring take off & Landing with a model without u/c
« Reply #9 on: 06, February 2019, 08:34:48 PM »
Hi Eddie

Sounds like you already have the T shirt on that one then.

The days are getting longer already  8)

Take care and catch up in August if not before!

Mike

p.s. Perhaps at the World Cup, definitely worth a visit if it's possible (I'll be visiting that one as opposed to competing  ;)  )
« Last Edit: 06, February 2019, 08:39:46 PM by Mike Wood »